SCOTT DETROW, HOST:
The Department of Justice has reached a settlement with Live Nation, the world's largest live entertainment company. The DOJ, along with 40 attorneys general, sued Live Nation in 2024 under former President Biden. They accused the company, which also owns Ticketmaster, of running a monopoly and wanted to see it broken up. The settlement still needs a judge's sign-off, but if it does go through, what could it mean for the broader live music industry? Here to help us answer all of this is Leah Nylen, who covers antitrust for Bloomberg News. She joins us from the courthouse in New York. Welcome to ALL THINGS CONSIDERED.
LEAH NYLEN: Thanks for having me.
DETROW: Before we get into what happened most recently, can you rewind a little bit and bring us up to speed - how this lawsuit began, how things proceeded from there?
NYLEN: Yeah. So the Justice Department, under the Biden administration, and most of the U.S. states sued Live Nation for operating an illegal monopoly in the live events industry. So the company, Live Nation, is both a concert promoter and it also owns Ticketmaster, which controls concert ticketing at something like 87% of venues across the U.S. And the Justice Department argues that it has used its control over those two things to sort of mutually reinforce its monopoly, i.e., it would threaten venues that don't want to use Ticketmaster by saying they would withhold important concerts from that venue.
DETROW: I want to talk about the details of the settlement, but first, is it fair to say that the details themselves seem to be murky and changing at this moment in time?
NYLEN: That is a very good description...
DETROW: OK.
NYLEN: ...Of what's going on.
DETROW: What happened? It was announced, and then what happened since?
NYLEN: So the Justice Department had started the trial last week, and then they came in today and said, we have a settlement. There's no need for a trial anymore. And then the states got up and said, we don't actually know very much about the terms that the Justice Department has agreed to.
DETROW: Ah, OK.
NYLEN: The judge was really unhappy about this because no one mentioned anything to him about it until last night at 8 p.m. So, you know, he had the jurors here ready to hear some testimony, and then all of a sudden, there's no testimony for them maybe to hear ever again because maybe this trial isn't going forward. And then it turns out that they don't really have a settlement. What they have is a term sheet. They have agreed to some terms with Ticketmaster, but they don't have, like, a written - a full written agreement.
DETROW: But let me just clarify. This was announced by the DOJ. This wasn't, like, leaked or anything like that. They said, we have a deal, when, in fact, they didn't have a deal yet.
NYLEN: Yes. So they came into court and said, well, we have this term sheet, so we think you should put off the trial. And we'll, you know, finalize this at a later point in time.
DETROW: Interesting.
NYLEN: So already there is a lot of dispute about what it is exactly that anyone has agreed to.
DETROW: So the first question I had when I saw this news was that - what does this mean for the 17 different lines of ambiguous fees that I come across when I'm trying to buy a ticket? I think a lot of people in that same camp. Do we have a sense what this could mean, or is the answer, like you're just saying, we actually have no idea at this point in time?
NYLEN: That's a slightly disputed thing. So the Justice Department says that Live Nation has agreed to cap the fees at 15%, so you will not have to pay more than 15% on any ticket. Live Nation says, yeah, OK, we agreed to do that on amphitheaters or arenas we own. So that means that if it is one of the 200-something venues across the U.S. that Live Nation owns, those fees would be capped, but nowhere else, even if Ticketmaster is the company that is doing the ticketing. So it's not exactly clear whether this addresses that issue.
DETROW: Given the unprecedented and murky situation that you're covering right now, what is the main thing you're looking for to try and get some clarity here?
NYLEN: Yeah. So the judge was pretty angry about how this settlement was rolled out to him and also when the states were informed. They have now asked for a mistrial. The judge isn't quite sure if that's fair to the jury that's already been seated or to Live Nation itself. He has now scheduled a hearing for tomorrow morning where Live Nation's CEO is going to have to get up there and testify about what he thinks this settlement means. And the person who signed it at the Justice Department also has to show up and talk a little bit about what he thinks it means. So maybe that will give us a little bit more clarity about what is supposedly in this agreement and whether we are going to keep having a trial at all.
DETROW: Leah Nylen, a reporter for Bloomberg News, thank you so much. And I will say, I'm really looking forward to reading your article about this tomorrow morning and seeing what is clarified and what isn't. Thank you.
NYLEN: Thank you.
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